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 Post subject: Help with a Scottish triangle
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:11 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Posts: 186
Hello All,
We received an e-mail from Canada with a query which we are unable to answer.

This is the part of the message that applies.
Quote
A recent interest has been stampless covers, particularly from the Niagara region in Southern Ontario, where I grew up. But in hunting these down, I've picked up the odd piece of 'world' stationary. That includes this folded stampless letter dated Feb 17 1841. It was sent from Manchester to Perth, Scotland. On the back are two cancels, the red Manchester, which I think is pretty straight forward and a receiver or transit cancel, with no location. I think this may have been red originally but is oxidizing. I understand the M stands for 'morning' but can you tell me what the triangle means. I understand it is some kind of code, but what?
Unfortunately there is no correspondence inside, which I guess makes this a cover sheet. I've attached scans of both sides plus the return address
Unquote

We have half a dozen reference books including the 9th edition of ‘Collect British Postmarks’ but are unable to find a reference to the triangle mark.
That catalogue shows the type as ‘Single circle, many sizes, red 1812-1839’

Wilcocks ‘The Postal History of Great Britain and Ireland’ shows the type as ‘1812-1857 Different sizes of letters or initials’

We suspect that the triangle may be the equivalent of an ‘additional mark’ for use when traffic was heavy, or perhaps in the way later marks were ‘relief’.

We would really appreciate any help on this.
Regards.
Ron and Eunice.


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 Post subject: Re: Help with a Scottish triangle
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2015 9:54 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 10, 2014 5:38 pm
Posts: 15
looks like you're correct in the code for a time


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 Post subject: Re: Help with a Scottish triangle
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 12:27 am 
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Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Posts: 186
Thanks for that prompt response. We do not have that book, ours is the British postmarks up to 1840, and there is no listing for the time codes.
All the other references we have seen indicate that the left 'letter' is a stamp identifier, rather than a time code. Do the previous pages show any indication of what time the triangle would represent please?
We have done a Google search for time codes but with no success.

At least we were right in identifying it as Edinburgh, and are surprised that it is a wooden stamp as the impression is so clear we thought it might have been a steel stamp.

Ron and Eunice


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 Post subject: Re: Help with a Scottish triangle
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 11:13 am 
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Joined: Sat May 10, 2014 5:38 pm
Posts: 15
http://www.gbps.org.uk/information/downloads/files/The%20History%20of%20the%20Postmarks%20of%20the%20British%20Isles%20from%201840%20to%201876%20(1909)%20-%20John%20Hendy.pdf

book available in the GBPS Downloads section

have looked at previous page but no mention of what the mark actually ment

regards Graham


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 Post subject: Re: Help with a Scottish triangle
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 12:02 am 
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Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Posts: 186
Many thanks for that Graham, I will check it out and download.
Thanks also for checking re the mark on previous pages.
Regards.
Ron and Eunice.


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 Post subject: Re: Help with a Scottish triangle
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 2:43 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2007 6:00 pm
Posts: 90
Hi Ron and Eunice

I disagree with Hendy on two counts: I believe the datestamp was steel; and the symbol was a stamper's code (or at least an identifying code of some kind), the right-hand letter indicating the time of day. According to Alcock & Holland and Mackay, most (but not all) of the letters of the alphabet were used, as well as asterisks, daggers and triangles.

Best wishes

Mike


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 Post subject: Re: Help with a Scottish triangle
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 1:07 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 6:00 pm
Posts: 186
Hi Mike,

Thanks for that, it is good to get responses.
I haven’t got around to downloading the Hendy yet, must do.

We will pass your message on to the person who made the initial enquiry.

Best regards
Ron and Eunice


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